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Commenting article: Johan Cruyff Slams Dutch "Vulgar" Style

#61
Bill - 14 Jul 2010 // 21:13:58

DrFaust:

A more accurate description is a word you may not be familiar with. People like her are called in American slang a "Buttinski".

#62
NellieotAmerica - 15 Jul 2010 // 03:10:16

WW

You said to Bill: "Nah, I think it's more your inability to retain information or handle complexity..."

At his age?!? We are lucky he can string together the sentences he does manage to string together.

How about your grandmother? I bet she is not even computer literate. Or do you guys e-mail each other?

#63
NellieotAmerica - 15 Jul 2010 // 03:15:53

Fester

"When 'defunct' behaviour pays off, people are acting accordingly. (We can see this also here in the forum...) And of course the players realized very early in the match that it pays off. Clearly the fault of the referee."

What exactly did you expect the ref to do? Throw a few more red cards instead of yellow ones? Stop the game every 10 seconds instead of every 20 seconds to award yellow cards? The referee could do nothing more than he was already doing short of stopping the game and throwing Holland out of the tournament. Just red card the whole damn team and give second place to Germany and third to Uruguay.

#64
Bill - 15 Jul 2010 // 05:15:13

Nellie:

"What exactly did you expect the ref to do? Throw a few more red cards instead of yellow ones?"

Exactly. If he had red carded the frirst, it's not likely that the rowdy play would continue, but if it had, Cruyff was right. They should have been down to nine.

#65
DrFaust - 15 Jul 2010 // 09:15:34

"What exactly did you expect the ref to do? Throw a few more red cards instead of yellow ones?"

No, just one in the beginning when the first rude foul occurred. The players would have got the message and behaved not the way they did. Is that really so difficult to understand?

#66
Dutch - 15 Jul 2010 // 10:43:58

"No, just one in the beginning when the first rude foul occurred. The players would have got the message and behaved not the way they did. Is that really so difficult to understand?"

It seems to me that many think that the behaviour of football players is different than people in everydays life. Well, not quite, it is exactly the same. Give anyone an opportunity where it should not be given and guaranteed the opporunity will be used.

Imagine the following: A company where it emerges one employee steals. The owner/manager then has several options:
1. Kick the thief out and report him to the police
2. Give the thief a second a second chance by giving him/her a written warning.

Option 2 will defacto lead to more theft (by the same and/or other employees). Option 1, releasing the thief from his/her duties and reporting him/her to the police, will show the owner/manager is on top of the game and this for sure will have a preventive effect. The remaining employees will think more than twice before stealing anyting as their a$$ is at stake.

Been there, done that and this policy (option 1) was drilled in my head on the 1st day of my management training. I have had two cases in 10 years I had to send people away. After these cases no more thefts with the remaining employees in the company where I was responsible of all stock (computer equipment) worth 80 million.

#67
Bill - 15 Jul 2010 // 11:53:49

DrFaust:

Since nowadays the referee and the line judges are in radio contact with each other, the only possible excuse they have for not giving the red is that they didn't see it.

#68
WickedWitch - 15 Jul 2010 // 15:13:15

Fistula,

"No, just one in the beginning when the first rude foul occurred. The players would have got the message and behaved not the way they did. Is that really so difficult to understand?"

Right, because at the last World Cup when the Dutch lost in an even uglier game, all the red and yellow cards made a difference.

Methinks all you pishman-commentators and -football analysts would do better to watch some old games and get things in 1) perspective and 2) context.

#69
WickedWitch - 15 Jul 2010 // 15:21:45

FYI, for those who don't know what I'm talking about.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/world_cup_2006/4991538.stm

I watched both games, the 2006 one and the 2010 one and I don't remember ever having been so revolted by a football game in my life after the 2006 one.

#70
Bill - 15 Jul 2010 // 15:44:35

DrFaust/Dutch:

I don't know whether this has any bearing on the truth, but I've just realised that the only avid supporters of the referee are female. (I didn't think he was that good-looking. hehehe)

WW seems to think that having a couple of referee friends makes her an expert. I wonder if she's ever played the game. I have. At any rate, she seems determined to trolll, castigate and insult any who disagree with her. So what else is new?

#71
WickedWitch - 15 Jul 2010 // 16:08:10

"I don't know whether this has any bearing on the truth, but I've just realised that the only avid supporters of the referee are female. (I didn't think he was that good-looking. hehehe)"

Right, because females only think with their hormones, etc. And you wonder how we can tell you're sexist? You aren't even hiding it well.

You having played football has no bearing on anything. I can't really think of anyone in my acquaintance who hasn't, including myself. But you trouncing about after a couple of friends in the vague direction of a goalpost or two does not make you more qualified than someone who's been refereeing games for decades and is qualified enough to decide a WC final.

#72
WickedWitch - 15 Jul 2010 // 16:10:36

"At any rate, she seems determined to trolll, castigate and insult any who disagree with her. So what else is new?"

Posting evidence of what happens when your suggestion of early cards is implemented in comparable conditions and with the same team against a similarly strong opponent is trolling... Maybe if it were opposite day.

#73
Bill - 15 Jul 2010 // 16:56:33

WW:

It was more than trouncing around with a couple of friends. It was team play.

But then I keep forgetting that you are mistress of all known forms of humanendeavor. Permit me to show you at least three in which you are horriby deficient: Humility, diplomacy and common courtesy.

#74
WickedWitch - 15 Jul 2010 // 17:35:59

Bill,

So you're still going to refuse to address the point about the 2006 Dutch game, eh?

Thought as much.

#75
Bill - 15 Jul 2010 // 17:48:59

"":

"So you're still going to refuse to address the point about the 2006 Dutch game, eh?"

Why not? It's irrelevant to the match under discussion.

The point, since you've missed it completely, is whether or not the referee of THIS match did what he should have done to prevent continued violence.

What some other referee(s) may have done years ago is simply irrelevant.

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