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Commenting article: Total Goofs: Bulgaria Youth Hate Books, Best Versed in Pop Folk

CreepyS - 31 Aug 2007 // 09:51:56

well, what comes after is the system created by folks raised and educated before so these 2 things - the work environment after education and the education itself are closely related - one leads to the other with a delay of 10-20 years. in the case of bg its a vicious circle that should be broken.

a couple of years ago i asked a south korean office mate how comes they are so good in electronics - my pc screen at job is samsung designed by f.a. porsche.

he told me it was a government policy - at first they sent many bright youngsters to study electronics in japan and promised them top jobs and high salaries when they come back in korea, which the government held so the brain drain stopped. now they educate their people themselves with a lot of emphasise on math, programming etc. since the age of 5. i find this a bit overdone but the general idea is good imo.

CreepyS - 31 Aug 2007 // 09:11:37

btw, we had 3 Swedish teenagers for 6 months here aged 17, 18 an 19 - two girls and one boy. If this is the average Swedish youth as i think, wow - very good english, very good education, maturity, well prepared for the life, sex appeal.

Robin - 31 Aug 2007 // 09:07:28

It's important for all countries to have a quality work force. But you also have to provide this quality work force some genuine quality in their adult life. I for one don't agree with the continuous slagging off of the BG education system. In fact I think it produces it's fair share of "academic" (or otherwise qualified) types. The problem is actually there's nothing much to do in BG with such qualifications. At uni you'll get 200lv/month as a "researcher" doing stuff of sufficient basicness so that your superiors don't have to worry about their positions. In professional companies you'll get 500-1000lv as a worker and see various brothers, sisters and otherwise unqualified friends of the boss take the good roles. So what do you do? You leave the country. We all know it's called the brain drain - but in order for there to be a brain drain there has to be something worth draining. So the education is not the problem in my eyes, it's what comes after that is the problem.

Bill - 31 Aug 2007 // 08:56:55

For anyone still interested enough to look:

Here's a quote from WW:

"countered with stuff you made up and non-sequiturs about starving people."

If she's so hard-hearted as to call what I was saying a non-sequitur, I feel sorry for her. She must be incapable of compassion. What I was saying was not made up.

DA keeps saying I SPAM all the time. Well, so far as I can tell, anything that disagrees with her exalted opinion is classified by her as SPAM:

Both of these women, in my estimation, are the type who will do anything they can to advance their own careers, without the slightest care about who else might be hurt in the process. Fortunately, I've met only a few of this type, but they were miserable to work with.

DA has also rehashed George's years to get his degrees. I thought we had disposed of that issue by explaining that he didn't take these degreees either simultaneously or consecutively. There were years of experience between them. But DA's using the time span as a means of making him look lazy, a slow learner, or otherwise mentally handicapped. This is typical of her postings. She simply cannot post without demeaning the party she's addressing, or anyone she's indirectly addressing.

In short, both of the women are poison in the workplace.

Viking, on the other hand, goes on to say that I must be a low-life without much education because I finished out my career in the Civil Service with the Army. Between my discharge from the Navy and going into the Civil Service, lie ten years in civilian industry, including some very highly placed positions. However, I wasn't happy in the atmosphere, because I was asked several times to do things I considered unethical or even immoral. I doubt very much that an incompetent person would have the sheaf of certificates and letters of commendation that I have in my desk drawer!

The reason I went into the Civil Service was quite simple. I already had ten years of military service creditable as government employment. If I quit my job and went to another company, I'd have had to work another 20 years to qualify for retirement, but by joining the Civil Service, I could retire in ten. The choice seemed obvious. True, I could have made a lot more money by staying where I was in two of those positions, but I gave them up in preference to other consderations. Money has never been my prime concern.

The Civil Service with the military also offered me travel opportunities I wouldn't have had otherwise, and that at govrnment expense. I could now tour Europe for what other US tourists have to pay merely for the flight over here alone.

All in all, I've never regretted that decision. I'm where I wanted to be. I'm retired out of the rat race. I don't have to deal with "bloodthirsty" competition. I'm my own boss. I could have lived on a higher social level, but that's all superifcial junk anyway.

CreepyS - 31 Aug 2007 // 08:01:04

Hi Robin,

I think Meglena Kuneva said something of the sort during a visit to bg, that bg youth is europes future.

Anyway, my point was not about old vs young generation. bg is a small and relatively poor country that wants to become richer i presume.

big developed countries dont have to bother too much about youth barbarization, they get their 5-6% of smart well educated people anyway. small by population countries like the netherlands, luxembourg, sweden, finland, have put a lot of attention to education and foreign languages, it works fine.

for bg, it is important to have a quality work force - otherwise it wont be able to develop fast enough to catch the others and it wont be able to attract many investors either thats why good education standards and and foreign languages are important.

Robin - 31 Aug 2007 // 05:11:00

Who has ever "dubbed" the Bulgarian youth "Europe's bright future"???

I've never seen that said anywhere... is SNA inventing things now?

Plus the stats are no different anywhere else in the world. And I think people read too much into all this. I think for one the way education is taught is changing. Certainly in the UK I get the impression it is shifting more into how to cope with life than having semi-random facts drilled into you. Now you may or may not agree with this but that's how it is.

The fact that the older people think the youth of the day are a disrespectful, uneducated bunch loosers who are inferior to the youth of yesteryear is nothing new. I think most of you will agree with this:

"I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words. When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint."

Hesiod, 700BC

So we've survived almost 3000 years with a continuously degrading youth. I think we're in good hands!

just me - 31 Aug 2007 // 03:16:42

Hey WW-
"Oh god, I hope so. This program has done so much harm to schools that it will take decades to erase its legacy."

This program has done so much harm to CHILDREN that it will take decades to erase its legacy.

I know this. I had a child in a top TEXAS school... and that was just for KINDERGARTEN!

Can you say.... "debacle?"

Devil's Advocate - 31 Aug 2007 // 01:32:07

For once and for all.... YOU CANNOT DEBATE!!! You can SPAM and you are very talented at that, but that is only as far as your talents run...

Devil's Advocate - 31 Aug 2007 // 01:09:30

"Oh god, I hope so. This program has done so much harm to schools that it will take decades to erase its legacy."

IMHO, that is an understatement!!!!

WickedWitch - 31 Aug 2007 // 01:01:42


"BTW, once Bush is out I fully expect NCLB to be reversed. "

Oh god, I hope so. This program has done so much harm to schools that it will take decades to erase its legacy.

WickedWitch - 31 Aug 2007 // 00:58:51

Bleh, actually, there should be a "and many will drop out" after "go to college".

Didn't mean to imply that not going to college doomed one to a lifetime of flipping burgers even though it's hard to get a good job nowadays without some post-high-school qualification.

Devil's Advocate - 31 Aug 2007 // 00:58:37

I completely agree to a point.

Hollywood does corrupt, but not in the way that Billy-boy would like us all to think...

Hollywood creates a false impression to those ignorant George like minds (and Bill's too) that the US is made up of people who look and act in only the way that Hollywood portrays life. It is not reality but rather a corrupted fiction that some creative minds have decided to stereotype how life in America really is.

BTW, once Bush is out I fully expect NCLB to be reversed. There are so many studies out that show how that one initiative has failed schools in America! At least it will be a small step in the right direction...

WickedWitch - 31 Aug 2007 // 00:48:24


I guess by some atom-entanglement-cum-osmosis, Bulgarian kids don't know Darwin because Hollywood is corrupting the American youth.

What really amuses me (aside from the fact that George keeps emoting his calls for Bulgarians to come back to BG and build it safely from his Canadian home) is that they keep blabbing on about the consumerist youth and they didn't catch onto a very crucial statement in Nextweus's post, namely the fact that 90% of his inner-city classmates would not go to college. And without college they will work menial jobs flipping burgers and such. That is a great failing of the schools, not the culture and not Hollywood and not Cosmo. It's a rant for a different thread but out of those 90% of kids, most want to work and make something of themselves but are denied this by the horrific underfunding and the unrealistic standards pushed onto the system.

I've volunteered at one of the schools in Columbus and I've met so many bright kids who were never taught BASIC stuff. I am talking about the Pythagorean theorem about the sum of angles in a triangle, stuff like that. Instead, they were taught how to pass exams and fall into obscurity. Yes, they will be frustrated. Yes, they will be annoyed at a world that denies them a good enough chance at an education and thusly a good job.

But no, it's Hollywood that corrupts them.

Devil's Advocate - 31 Aug 2007 // 00:37:42

Bill is like an annoying mosquito... he keeps buzzing and buzzing and no matter how hard you try and kill it, it still won't die. In the meantime it finds a way to suck your blood and leave you with a big itchy spot! (in other words his attitude is soooo annoying, but there is a twisted pleasure involved in provoking the stupidity...)

WickedWitch - 31 Aug 2007 // 00:30:37



Soldier: [to Frou Frou] and you, aristo-pig, are trapped!!!

Frou Frou: Peeg? HAH! You will regret your insolence, revolutionary deug!

Solider: Dog? HAH! You will regret your arrogance, royalist snake!

Frou Frou: Sneag? HAH!

Edmund Blackadder: [stepping in] Look, I've very sorry to interrupt this very interesting discussion, but it really is none of my business, so I think I'll be on my way. Come on, Baldrick.

Keep on HAHing bravely Bill.

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