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Commenting article: Beijing Angry with Dissident's Prize

Beijing has strongly condemned the decision by the European Parliament to award its annual human rights prize to Hu Jia, a jailed Chinese dissident.

"We express strong dissatisfaction and stern opposition," a Foreign Ministry spokesman, Qin Gang, said in a statement.
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#1
mavro from australia - 1 Nov 2008 // 02:38:06

By ripping out of a person of their organs you're basically humiliating them and for propaganda purposes its teaches people that this is the sort of person that deserves it. Human nature being the way it is, people will think that the victim deserves it just for being the victim.
It is basically political you can make a deserving victim out anyone.

#2
Kolegialen - 31 Oct 2008 // 21:45:58

"I want to dig deeper into your post on the difference between western and eastern communism but it will probably have to wait till monday."

JKS,
I think you are falling into the Western propaganda notion that China is Communist.
It is not.
It's more Fascist actually - a combination between European and Chilean brand Fascism - strong government, unfriendly to Democracy, but very friendly to business and corporations, not without its nationalist streak as well - classic blend, which explains why the Western Left is so much against them.
They loved Eastern Europe, remember?

I will be away from computers until mid next week so we can pick it up then.

#3
Kolegialen - 31 Oct 2008 // 19:57:54

"There is nothing TO get."

OK, I'll go with that.
Now go!

#4
Kolegialen - 31 Oct 2008 // 19:53:19

(Go buy your kid a pack of smokes and bottle of the good stuff, so she can truly feel Bulgarian :)

You are joking, but I do have that problem of having children who are more "moralistic" than I - what's with the coupling any way?
From 12 - 13 on they all wanna have a boyfriend/girlfriend and basically act married from the start - it's an American tragedy, I tell you!
I try to teach them that life is best with multiple, casual, partners, but alas.... I fear I will serve only to perpetuate that vicious American circle, one day when they grow up - married - divorced, married - divorced ... can you fukc people without marring them for COL?

I loved my youth....

#5
Proud-to-be-Nellie - 31 Oct 2008 // 19:47:09

kolega,

There is nothing TO get. Your rant is entirely devoid of any sense. Chinese are practical pragmatists. They like money, it makes it possible for them to eat. They are selling organs? All people who die in automobile accidents in the US are possible organ donors. So? What is your point? There is no point, the point is on top of your Bulgarian thick head.

#6
Kolegialen - 31 Oct 2008 // 19:40:15

"What's your point about China?"
Do you need some help comprehending the conversation?

Read the whole tread, slowly, and then try to think hard.
May be then you'll get it - you never know!

#7
Proud-to-be-Nellie - 31 Oct 2008 // 18:37:11

kolegialen,

What's your point about China? You talk about practical and pragmnatic like it is a bad thing. I think it is a good thing. The more practical and pragmatic the better. Chinese want to eat too, just like Bulgarians.

#8
Kolegialen - 31 Oct 2008 // 18:31:24

"The majority of Chinese are not strapped in a bed getting their organs ripped out of them."

I can't make sense of your post, but let me just say that the majority of the Chinese are purely interested in one thing - money.
Never met more unapologetically money-hungry folks in my life - and some of my friends are what you'd consider BG mutri, so get perspective here!

China's culture is super pragmatic.
Example of that lady, who was told that she can't get on the bus with a life chicken, because of new Asian Flue rules:
She slammed the chicken against the bust stop pole and said - here - it's not live any more!
(this actually happened)
I swear that's how they are - brutal, greedy, and pragmatic - why waste a man's organs, if you're gonna kill him any way?
Very basic logic and that's cultural.
Attempting to change that, is equal to messing with their culture.

#9
Proud-to-be-Nellie - 31 Oct 2008 // 15:58:26

What nonsense! Machiavelli is required reading in every management class in every management school in the entire US. How do you think people like Jack Welch, the old retired CEO of GE made GE into what it used to be and no longer is today?

#10
JKS - 31 Oct 2008 // 08:36:23

Did you read "The Prince"?
If you don't have it there, I'll bring you a copy next time in BG - just for you!

Thanks for the thought! I actually have a copy in the States. I bring a bunch with me every time I go back and forth, but it was never high enough on my list to make it into my suitcase:)

I can read it online now. I tried to read it in high school but obviously did not appreciate it. I will try and move it up in my reading priorities over the next month or so, then I can have an informed opinion.

After our last conversation I started reading about the history of the term "Machiavellianism". You are right. The term originally stood for "liberal" forms of governing and was considered very humane. Later it evolved into its current form of standing for brutal pragmatism and inhumanity. That's what we get in a pop culture world that communicates through soundbites.

I want to dig deeper into your post on the difference between western and eastern communism but it will probably have to wait till monday.

Have a good weekend. (Go buy your kid a pack of smokes and bottle of the good stuff, so she can truly feel Bulgarian :)

#11
mavro from australia - 31 Oct 2008 // 02:36:44

The majority of Chinese are not strapped in a bed getting their organs ripped out of them.
Do you really think that they really want to live like that!! I know they don't I have spoken to them.

#12
Kolegialen - 30 Oct 2008 // 23:24:44

"(a big assumption for a Machiavellian) ;)"

Did you read "The Prince"?
If you don't have it there, I'll bring you a copy next time in BG - just for you!

I find it amazing, that in the Anglo world, his name has acquired notoriety on level with Marquis De Sade or something - almost synonymous to evil and perversion....

#13
Kolegialen - 30 Oct 2008 // 23:05:49

"By having any Democratically elected leader shaking hands with Todor Zhivkov or .."

Babi and jabi - very different cases.

Jivkov&co impoverished BG and her people.
The isolated us from the world and ran the place to the ground.

The Chinese government did exactly the opposite - enriched China and her people, opened it to the world, brought the world in, in form of major investments, successfully re-integrated Hong Kong, and is generally taking them to heights unknown for China!

As far as Democracy, - most Chinese instinctively feel that had they gotten Democracy before a powerful middle class, it wouldn't have degenerated to cleptocracy and mafia run state, as it happened in neighboring Russia.

Every person I talked to in China, defended their government and not out of fear - I can tell fear - I do work with American men after all, and fear rules here;)
(the way you know, is when they look around before saying something - very American these days;)

#14
JKS - 30 Oct 2008 // 20:54:26

"That's bullshit."

Ko,

For arguments sake what would you say to someone that say 40 years ago said:

"By having any Democratically elected leader shaking hands with Todor Zhivkov or any other of his mates we are basically telling the Bulgarian race that they are much worthless than a bunch of genetically altered pigs."

Also assuming that the person actually cared for the people he was talking about (a big assumption for a Machiavellian) ;)

#15
Kolegialen - 30 Oct 2008 // 17:48:25

"By having any Democratically elected leader shaking hands with Hu Jingtao or any other of his mates we are basically telling the Chinese race that they are much worthless than a bunch of genetically altered pigs."

That's bullshit.
Chinese people are very eager for their country to receive international respect, and money is the only thing that matters to them.
The vast majority is also very chauvinistic, and supportive of their government.
Most Chinese are convinced that the 21st century is owed to them, and that this is the only government that will take them there.

Just go to China and talk to them....

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